Air Ride and Handling

[Brandon C]

Alright, before I ask, realize I have zero experience in air-ride systems, aside from a kid I knew in high school, who had a real POS Dakota on bags. a POS mainly because it was always finding new, creative ways to implode upon itself, but that's not the point.

I've been given an 04 Accord EX as a 'Christmas Gift' (IE I was driving it all the time anyway and my regular car is near-dead), so I'm figuring to stance it. I'm debating between a static system (unlikely) and air ride.

Air ride looks far more promising, mainly because I got a steep incline on my driveway, and driving through the city means I'll need some clearance now and again. I know plenty of people who are mechanical pros, and I know I'd have the money for the setup by the end of the summer, but my main concern is handling. I don't go to autocross meets or anything, but I've been told by a few of my fellow enthusiasts that air + FWD = the sloppiest handling on earth. That's not gonna cut it for me. I want to stance the car, but if I have to compromise the handling in any noticeable way, I'm probably out, and I'll look more at statics, or just getting something cheap to stance.

I'm more looking for personal experience than anything else at the moment, and if there are any techs who see this, it would be awesome to get a basic rundown.

[FreshLikeSushi]

i drifted on my air ride setup
uas bags on coilovers
individual results may vary, intelligence helps, an understanding of suspension theory and how to adjust. knowing how a shock works, and air bags work and intrinsic

[Han]

An air bag just replaces the spring. Air pressure equates to a "spring rate." I don't know the specifics as in equation to get said rates, but yeah.

[FreshLikeSushi]

but you have to look at it more than that
at half a stroke, will your shock act the same as at the full length?
Where are yuor bumpstops at?
can you still have enough travel to bottom out yur bag before the strut?
goes on and on

if you can answer, or figure out those answers, you can do it and be happy.

[kartikeya]

Same thing as with springs. A little bit of knowledge and a little bit of common sense is all you need to get the most out of an air suspension setup.

[FreshLikeSushi]

wrong
airbags are a variable spring rate

[kartikeya]

wrong
airbags are a variable spring rate

The equivalent spring rates of the 'parked' or 'clearing a speed bump' pressures are irrelevant. What matters is the pressure at ride height. You're selecting a bag height and pressure, similar to how you'd choose a spring length and rate.

[FreshLikeSushi]

what if said pressure at ride height is different from wheel to wheel?
what if shock stroke is too little for ride height, and not enough for speed bump height?
i can keep going and going and going
ive done a dozen of these

[kartikeya]

what if said pressure at ride height is different from wheel to wheel?

Then equalize and adjust the height...

what if shock stroke is too little for ride height, and not enough for speed bump height?

What kind of strut doesn't have even a few inches of stroke overall? That's not a realistic scenario, to have both issues, unless you've really cocked something up.

[FreshLikeSushi]

miata....
soooo realistic
i have 3.70 inches of stroke

[kartikeya]

Okay. And how would a bag that is the correct length at ride pressure be an issue here?

[FreshLikeSushi]

noone makes a COB bag short enough with the specs i want.

[kartikeya]

Okay, so we've established that for your particular needs for your application a part is not available.

To put the thread back on track- figuring out what you need is not difficult if you understand a few key points and approach the setup systematically.

[FreshLikeSushi]

you derailed it

i merely mentioned points that needed to be thought about when mating a setup.
good job

[Rally]

Where are yuor bumpstops at?

Many people solve this by running inverted monotube struts so that they still retain bumpstops within the strut.

You may not be able to find a slip-over bag in your length, but you can get non slip-over bags that are quite short so that they run at a higher spring rate and shorter overall bag height. Airhouses come to mind. 2" compressed, only 7" fully extended.

If you're lacking stroke/travel, it's probably because your struts are too long and they are compressed too much at your desired height. This can be cured with a shorter strut to free up travel. MINI's have tiny amounts of travel in the rear (1.9"), so I swapped out to shorter struts with far more travel in the rear.